Interview with Catherine de Sauvage

Desiree Robinson

Meet Catherine de Sauvage, Somatic Experienced Practitioner, Sex therapist, and certified 4-D Wheel practitioner.

What was your first introduction to the 4-D Wheel, and what made you want to learn more?

In 2015, Gina Ogden introduced me to the 4-D Wheel at Esalen. It didn’t take me long to realize the major benefits of that approach. As an inexperienced therapist, I was struggling with some pitfalls like merging with my client, working harder than my client, or feeling the need to be in charge of the session. The 4-D Wheel not only solved all these problems but also added to the therapeutic process, more fun than I could possibly imagine.

I learned to let go and trust that the 4 dimensions: the heart, the mind, the body, the spirit (a simple walk around 4 cards on the ground) would help clients beautifully unravel and open on their own. By the simple process of asking questions, clients started to see how much wisdom they had inside themselves. Surprising results started to manifest during sessions, just like a good movie with a surprising ending.

The 4-D Wheel also offers an impeccable sacred space to the client, so I started to notice how clients would feel safe and dive into the process. They started to appreciate the power of good questions and would slowly learn to let go of their desire for quick answers.

I was also attracted to the shamanic dimension of the 4-D Wheel. The different rituals evoked during the process would help clients stay in the present moment and would protect them from being sucked into their own trauma vortex.

How do you use the 4-D Wheel and what is your specialty?

The 4-D Wheel has the great advantage of allowing all kinds of modalities to be integrated into its practice. As a Somatic Experienced practitioner, I can integrate my modality into the body quadrant. CBT therapists can integrate their skills into the mind quadrant. EFT therapists can integrate their approach working with the heart/ feeling quadrant. Yet, at the end of the process, the client feels held and supported by a holistic approach.

As a sex therapist and Somatic Experienced practitioner, I specialize in sexual trauma and sexual dysfunctions of all sorts.

The 4-D Wheel is a great way for me to rebuild safety and work on consent, especially in groups with women recovering from jail, sexual traumas, and addiction. I invite them to the Wheel and if they agree, I let them “feel” their “yes” as they walk to the circle. With practice, a lot of women realize that they accept my request just to please me and be a good girl. We process together how that translates into their sexuality with their partner(s). When they find the courage to say “no”: “I don’t want to go to the wheel today”, I ask them to sense what happens in their body (from their seat) and to memorize the sensations that cue their “no”.

As these women do the work around the Wheel, they also learn to feel their limit (by trial and error) and finally gather the courage to look at me to say: “ I am done, for now, I would like to go back to my seat”. They learn to pause, to be in the unknown, or set boundaries with me just the same way as they would do with a lover. I have witnessed a woman accessing her “no” for the first time in her life, she was sobbing supported by the group. That is the power of the 4-D Wheel. The 4-D Wheel is also a great way to help clients see which area in their life is underdeveloped. For example, clients may walk the wheel and notice that, while sharing their story, they never go into the heart or the spiritual quadrant. All of a sudden, they become curious about these new perspectives/quadrants in their life.

I also love to use the 4-D Wheel because it brings back movement into the client’s life. Clients come to us because they feel “ stuck “. In front of the wheel, they realize that if they are afraid of their feelings, they have alternatives such as exploring their thoughts, sensations, or higher power. They discover many new roads to express their truth.

What you hope to do more of in the world using the 4-D Wheel as one of your tools to help heal people?

I would love to broaden the definition of sexuality and have people explore intimacy beyond the physical quadrant. The wheel helps clients realize that they can have emotional sex (ex: exploring each other‘s feelings) or spiritual sex (ex: Tantra and more) or mental sex (ex: sharing each other‘s erotic fantasies/hot movie). I would love the world to understand that sexuality is so much more fun, complex & diverse than just the physical quadrant, especially during our quarantine process.

The 4-D Wheel is a wonderful tool to help the world understand that consent is a minute per minute process filled with “I am not sure”, “can you wait & give me space” and so much more than yes, no, or maybe. The richness of that exploration can be deeply expressed walking around the Wheel, supported by the rest of the group. Not everybody has the courage to walk around the Wheel, but that doesn’t matter because the shy ones will learn vicariously.

I would love the 4-D Wheel to help the world realize the myths & lies around sexuality such as: “sex should be spontaneous & natural, great lovers are born not made, great sex means great orgasms, sex deteriorates with age, great sex is for beautiful, able-bodied people, etc… It is time that we engage in a conversation around the 4-D Wheel to undo these lies because each one of them limits us and brings shame to our beautiful human condition.

I have used the 4-D Wheel with couples and I would love more therapists to see that wonderful process. We all struggle with couples when they argue and constantly interrupt each other. The therapist becomes the referee and the game is no longer fun. With the 4-D Wheel, one partner sits on the sofa, the other walks the wheel focusing on expressing his/her needs. The structure is so clear that interruptions are minimized. The partner sitting on the sofa knows the rule: the person walking the 4-D Wheel gets impeccable sacred space. The consequences of breaking the rules have been discussed and agreed at the beginning of the process. And this is only one way to play the 4-D Wheel in couple therapy. The Wheel brings order, respect, and safety to the couple therapy process. Partners often tell me: “I didn’t know she/he felt that way ….” and the empathy shift begins to do its miracle.

PS: lies and myths are courtesy of Peggy Kleinplatz:

Magnificent Sex: Lessons from Extraordinary Lovers, Peggy Kleinplatz A.Dana Menard Routledge

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Originally from Belgium, Catherine de Sauvage (She/Her/Hers) is a passionate certified Somatic Experienced Practitioner and certified Sex therapist. Her two years of experience with The Somatica method – a sex coaching approach (by Celeste Hirschman and Danielle Harel) has also allowed her to understand the importance of experiencing exercises in the body versus talking about experiences. She spent 9 years leading groups with people recovering from incarceration. She has learned from them the importance of being authentic and has also developed a profound respect for sex workers. Every Wednesday, she continues to be dedicated to women in transitional houses and help them re-author their story with Gina Ogden’s 4-D Wheel. She is also grateful to Peggy Kleinplatz who trained her in couple therapy and she strongly believes in her work & research.

You can visit Catherine on her website here.

She can also be reached by email: csauvage2@yahoo.com